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rickh57
 
 


Joined: 24 Dec 2004
Posts: 33

PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 8:02 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Question
Has anyone here played with Ruby on Rails (http://www.rubyonrails.org/)? It seems to be a very simple way of creating a data aware web application.

I'm wondering if this might be included in some future version of A2T (kind of like the latest version has added PostgreSQL...)

Rick
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Vlad Alexa Mancini
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Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Posts: 1539

PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 4:59 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I would let that age a bit first , however ruby is promissing , will keep my eyes on ruby on rails

I would think that php is the simplest as one needs to go , further than that is risky.

i have just read an article on ruby on rails vs hibernate http://www.theserverside.com/articles/article.tss?l=RailsHibernate
not realy a point on ror's side


Last edited by Vlad Alexa Mancini on Thu Apr 07, 2005 5:57 pm; edited 1 time in total
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gaminde
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Joined: 31 Mar 2005
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 5:33 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

With respect to the Server Side article:

Patrick Peak (the article's author) is also the co-author of Hibernate Quickly. He may be a little biased.

Other points to think about -

Hibernate and RoRs are really two different animals. Hibernate is a Java ORM Persistence tool, while RoR is an MVC framework.

Hibernate just released version 3.0, while RoR is at release 0.8.10. And, Hibernate has the force of Gavin King/JBoss behind it.

The article looks at the ORM aspects of RoR as compared to Hibernate and, no surprise, comes up short.



From the article:

Quote:
This further supports the theory that Rails is likely suitable for smaller projects, but its ORM layer lacks a number of the essential features that will allow it to scale up to larger projects.


I have a comment and a question based on that quote -

It is theory, he has done no benchmarking.

What is a smaller vs a larger project?



Still, the article does make some valid points and if the ORM aspects are what's important then a person should at least do some benchmarking before jumping on the RoR bandwagon.

Finally, it would be nice to see more of a heads up comparison with real numbers rather than theory and some mention of the MVC aspects of RoR. But, that wasn't the goal of the article.
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Piper
 
 


Joined: 07 Jan 2006
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2006 8:20 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

With out a doubt, Ruby on Rails is not only "suitable" for small projects, it is the best, simplest and fastest option I've ever seen. (And, we've not even mentioned Ajax yet). You simply cannot find a better solution. The "at least 10x faster" claim is no exaggeration.

And, even admitting this "Small Project" suitability; the suitability far far exceeds the requirements of the vast majority of potential projects.

When I read Peak's article, this is the main sentiment I infer:
"Oh dear God help us; these amatures are going to put us professionals out of work; they're rendering our years of training and experience nearly (but not quite) obsolete."

And, I empathize with him. Truly, I do.

Is RoR suitable for every conceivable project?
Certainly not.
But neither is MySQL as suitable over Oracle.
Or, Java over the raw naked power of the arcane art of C

The question is: who wants to deal with the complexity of the lower language when you can have it managed for you?

And, that's what RoR does. It is a higher level manifestation of managed complexity. Essentially, putting unprecedented potential in the hands of amatures!

Not quite unlike Apache2Triad itself, I dare say.
Laughing
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Vlad Alexa Mancini
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Joined: 07 Jul 2003
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2006 9:27 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Piper wrote:

Not quite unlike Apache2Triad itself, I dare say.
:lol:

Touche

In my opinion the amateurs will just get the bulk of the average paid programming jobs , the good paid and complex programming jobs will allways require someone with in depth programming knowledge
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Piper
 
 


Joined: 07 Jan 2006
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 7:44 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Vlad Alexa Mancini wrote:
Piper wrote:

Not quite unlike Apache2Triad itself, I dare say.
Laughing

Touche

In my opinion the amateurs will just get the bulk of the average paid programming jobs , the good paid and complex programming jobs will allways require someone with in depth programming knowledge


Not to impune your work, Sir, or that of Apache2Triad users.

I do not doubt that it is an excellent package for setting up a development environment on Windows machines. And, your package offers much better out-of-the-box security than the individual packages do themselves. Kudos to Vlad and Apache2Triad!

On a side note:
I would suggest, though, putting together an A2T package that more closesly reflects a typical commercial hosting environment. Or, even better yet, a package manager with auto configuration. One that would allow the A2T user to micro manage their versions to reflect their hosts environment. Like, Ruby's Gem package manager. Awsome! As a matter of fact, forget RoR, forget all the debate, forget everything. What A2T is missing is Ruby. Not that it's difficult to install seperately. But, neither are any of these individual packages. Having it integrated into A2T, though, would boost the package as a whole considerably. Ruby is, kinda like python, but even better. If you were to dive into it, Vlad, I'm sure you'll be pleasantly surprised. And given your obvious level of expertise already I'm sure you'd find your life made much easier in managing the A2T package.
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Vlad Alexa Mancini
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Joined: 07 Jul 2003
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 2:48 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

i had another closer look at ruby on rails lately , it is not bad , but it needs more work , and i mean more 2-10 years of development to grow out of the almost pathetic state it is
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Piper
 
 


Joined: 07 Jan 2006
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 4:00 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Your missing the point Vlad. Yes, RoR is young. I don't think anyone's rushing to run out and put that into production. (Yet, when it matures, oh yea.) I mean, they just released the first full version within the last 2 weeks?

The real hotty is Ruby itself. And its been around for a while
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jbardi
 
 


Joined: 08 Aug 2005
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Sun Apr 02, 2006 9:13 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Piper wrote:
Your missing the point Vlad. Yes, RoR is young. I don't think anyone's rushing to run out and put that into production. (Yet, when it matures, oh yea.) I mean, they just released the first full version within the last 2 weeks?

The real hotty is Ruby itself. And its been around for a while


I agree... I think individuals posting on this topic do not realize that Ruby and RoR are not the same thing. Ruby is strong and has been around a long time. Look at its history in Japan. Now RoR is young, but it is a framework.

Do not compare them both as if they are the same thing. Ruby is stable and worth adding to A2T. If those that install A2T then want to use RoR, then they can install Rails on their own.

I have done some AMAZING things with Ruby alone, and now with RoR. We all have opinions... but the proof is in the pudding. I have proven that it is worthy in real world environments and not "pathetic" at all. Until one actually starts using it instead of just reading about it, their opinion doesn't hold much water.
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Vlad Alexa Mancini
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Joined: 07 Jul 2003
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:59 am Reply with quoteBack to top

hate to break it to you but this topic is titled Ruby on Rails , hence it is about RoR not Ruby alone

so obviously all the comments from this individual are about Ruby on Rails and i am not missing the point i am staying on topic which i suggest you do to

and mind your tone guys
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x81kilo
 
 


Joined: 11 Dec 2003
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 7:21 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Hi all,
from the looks of it some people here want to try out RoR. From reading (and im not a programmer at all), I was able to search around and find the windows installer. I hope its as easy to learn as the php language im learning now. As for adding it into the apache2triad installer package, that is to be seen, a2t developers choice!

x81kilo
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AjnabiZ
 
 


Joined: 30 May 2006
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 2:15 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Hi

Are there any news on integrating Ruby on Rails to Apache2triad ?

Verion 1.2 has been released

Look at the examples here:
http://www.rubyonrails.org/screencasts
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deejay
 
 


Joined: 18 Jan 2007
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 11:27 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Any further news on this?? - or can someone give some guidance how to set up ROR within A2T

Thanks
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AjnabiZ
 
 


Joined: 30 May 2006
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 1:48 am Reply with quoteBack to top

hi

I think Apache2triad is dead. There has not been any new release for some time.

its better to move to xampp or wamp since they are being regularly developed.
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dale
 
 


Joined: 11 Jun 2006
Posts: 51
Location: las vegas, nv

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:42 am Reply with quoteBack to top

For deejay:

Go to the home page of Ruby on Rails and pay special detail to the part where it says 'What else do I need?'. Right here is what you need to make it work. I'm sure that the documentation will help YOU install all of the extra stuff you need, like the FastCGI or SCGI. I like the part where it says, "Just about any operating system will do, but we recommend a 'nix-based one for deployment." Maybe you can go to their forum for additional help.

For AjnabiZ:

I'm sure that Apache2triad is not dead. As with all applications, there are limitations. I'm sure that if you check out the xampp and wamp you will find that their software bundling will not have everything you want either. I'm sure that the reason why it takes so long to make a new release of Apache2Triad is that the people working on the project are making sure that it is a stable release.

Since this is about Ruby on Rails, I have this much to say about it. I went ahead and learned how to use the php language, and I'm just not impressed with Ruby on Rails. It looks like one more script editor that wastes time to learn when all that I have to do is learn the php. But that is just an opinion.
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